Thomas Jefferson and the Ground Zero Mosque

President Obama stepped into it over the weekend. Speaking Friday August 13, 2010, at a White House dinner to honor Ramadan, the President told his audience, “Muslims have the right to practice their religion as everyone else in this country,” an obvious reference to the controversy surrounding the Ground Zero mosque. On Saturday, while spending the day in the Gulf, the president attempted to clarify his earlier remarks: “I was not commenting and I will not comment on the wisdom of making the decision to put a mosque there. I was commenting very specifically on the right people have that dates back to our founding. That’s what our country is about.”

Utah’s attempts at statehood were held up over the religious practice of polygamy. It wasn’t until Utah agreed to include in its constitution a ban on polygamy that the territory was considered for statehood. Statehood was officially granted on January 4, 1896.

Prior to Utah’s statehood, the Supreme Court had ruled that “Bigamy and polygamy are crimes by the laws of all civilized and Christian countries”(1) and “the spread and practice of polygamy is . . . . contrary to the spirit of Christianity and of the civilization which Christianity has produced in the Western world.”(2) So contrary to President Obama, it’s not true that all people have “the right to practice their religion.” The First Amendment does not give unlimited freedom to individuals or groups who act in the name of religion, especially when that religion’s goal is the domination of the world or even a part of it by force.

On a side note, Judge Vaughn Walker, in the Proposition 8 decision, is arguing that the more than seven million people who voted to define marriage as between a man and a woman have no standing in their appeal of the case because they could not prove how homosexual marriage harms them.(3) The same argument could be made over bigamy and polygamy since no one is forced into multiple marriages and thereby can’t suffer harm by the polygamous practices of others. The Supreme Court in 1890 saw great societal harm in the religious practice of polygamy. In my estimation, the same argument can be made for Islam. Consider that German authorities “have closed a Hamburg mosque used by the Sept. 11 attackers as a meeting place before they moved to the United States. A statement by Hamburg officials says the Taiba mosque was shut down and its cultural association was banned” August 9, 2010.

The First Amendment begins: “Congress shall make no law. . . .” There is no prohibition on municipalities, counties, or states. Constitutionally, Congress, since it is supposed to be the only law-making national body, cannot make any law regarding religion that would affect the states. Cities, counties, and states can make determinations based on religion. An appeal to “our founding” will prove this to be true. Nearly all the state constitutions at the time had particular requirements dealing with religion over which the national government had no jurisdiction. If the states wanted the same, less, or more freedoms than found in the national constitution, the states had to provide for them in their constitutions. For example, here are the religious provisions in Alabama’s constitution:

That no religion shall be established by law; that no preference shall be given by law to any religious sect, society, denomination, or mode of worship; that no one shall be compelled by law to attend any place of worship; nor to pay any tithes, taxes, or other rate for building or repairing any place of worship, or for maintaining any minister or ministry; that no religious test shall be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under this state; and that the civil rights, privileges, and capacities of any citizen shall not be in any manner affected by his religious principles.

Why include these words if the First Amendment applied to the states?

President Obama and other supporters of the Ground Zero Mosque appeal to our nation’s “founding,” in particular Thomas Jefferson. Here are some additional comments the President made on August 14 in reference to Jefferson:

And tonight, we are reminded that Ramadan is a celebration of a faith known for great diversity. And Ramadan is a reminder that Islam has always been a part of America. The first Muslim ambassador to the United States, from Tunisia, was hosted by President Jefferson, who arranged a sunset dinner for his guest because it was Ramadan—making it the first known iftar(4) at the White House, more than 200 years ago.

First, Islam is not noted for its religious diversity. Christians cannot evangelize in Muslim countries. Churches are burned while police do nothing. Muslims who convert to another religion can be executed. Even the presence of the Bible is prohibited by our own military and the behest of Islamic officials when American soldiers are deployed in Muslim nations:

Bibles were confiscated and destroyed after Qatar-based Al Jazeer television showed soldiers at a Bible class on a base with a stack of Bibles translated into the local Pashto and Dari languages. The U.S. military forbids its members on active duty—including those based in places like Afghanistan—from trying to convert people to another religion. Reuters quotes Maj. Jennifer Willis at the Bagram Air Base, north of Kabul, who said “I can now confirm that the Bibles shown on Al Jazeera’s clip were, in fact, collected by the chaplains and later destroyed. They were never distributed.”(5)

Second, President Obama’s favorable appeal to Jefferson is only part of the story. The Koran’s peace initiatives are Orwellian: “Submission to Islam is peace.” Peace is the absence of any religious or political opposition. This is the indisputable history of Islam as Paul Johnson writes:

Koranic teaching that the faith or “submission” can be, and in suitable circumstances must be, imposed by force, has never been ignored. On the contrary, the history of Islam from Arabia was followed by the rapid conquest of North Africa, the invasion and virtual conquest of Spain, and a thrust into France that carried the crescent to the gates of Paris. It took half a millennium or reconquest to expel the Moslems from Western Europe. The Crusades, far from being an outrageous prototype of Western imperialism, as is taught in most of our schools, were a mere episode in a struggle that has lasted 1,400 years and were one of the few occasions when Christians took the offensive to regain the “occupied territories” of the Holy Land.(6)

What did Jefferson learn from his study of the Koran? As early as 1786, Jefferson, who was serving as the ambassador to France, and John Adams, the Ambassador to Britain, met in London with Ambassador Abdrahaman, the Dey of Tripoli’s ambassador to Britain, in an attempt to negotiate a peace treaty based on Congress’ vote of funding. Peace would come at a price. If America wanted “temporary peace,” a one-year guarantee, it would cost $66,000 plus a 10% commission. “Everlasting peace” was a bargain at $160,000 plus the obligatory commission. This only applied to Tripoli. Other Muslim nations would also have to be paid. The amount came to $1.3 million. But there was no assurance that the treaties would be honored. In vain Jefferson and Adams tried to argue that America was not at war with Tripoli. In what way had the U.S provoked the Muslims, they asked? Ambassador Abdrahaman went on to explain “the finer points of Islamic jihad” to the Koranically challenged Jefferson and Adams. In a letter to John Jay, Jefferson wrote the following:

The Ambassador answered us that it was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman [Muslim] who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.(7)

Abdrahaman was paraphrasing the Koran’s “rules of engagement” found in the 47 Surah: “Whenever you encounter the ones who disbelieve [during wartime], seize them by their necks until once you have subdued them, then tie them up as prisoners, either in order to release them later on, or also to ask for ransom, until war lays down her burdens.” Unless a nation submitted to an Islamic nation, whether it was the aggressor or not, that nation was by definition at war with Islam. Jihad means “to submit.” A non-aggressing nation is still at war with Islam as long as it hasn’t embraced Islam. Islam’s goal is to conquer the world, either by the submission of one’s will or by Allah’s sword.(8)

When President Jefferson refused to increase the tribute demanded by the Islamists, Tripoli declared war on the United States. A United States navy squadron, under Commander Edward Preble, blockaded Tripoli from 1803 to 1805. After rebel soldiers from Tripoli, led by United States Marines, captured the city of Derna, the Pasha of Tripoli signed a treaty promising to exact no more tribute.

President Obama is not the first person who has tried to whitewash Islam’s history with America. Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.), a Muslim, took his constitutional oath on Jefferson’s copy of the Koran. How ironic given Jefferson’s disdain for Islam’s principles. There’s a reason the “Marines’ Hymn” begins with these words:

From the Halls of Montezuma,

to the shores of Tripoli.

The line “To the shores of Tripoli” refers to the First Barbary War, specifically the Battle of Derne in 1805. Jefferson, embroiled in a war with Islamic terrorists in his day, commented, “Too long, for the honor of nations, have those Barbarians been suffered [permitted] to trample on the sacred faith of treaties, on the rights and laws of human nature!”(9) Little has changed since Jefferson’s day. The Muslims of the Ground Zero Mosque will say one thing and mean another.Endnotes:

  1. Davis v. Beason, 133 U. S. 333, 341-344, 348 n. (1890).()
  2. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints v. United States 136 U.S. 1, 49 (1890).()
  3. The seven million people have standing because their votes were nullified by a single judge. In addition, the process of amending the California constitution is by referendum: “A proposed amendment or revision shall be submitted to the electors and if approved by a majority of votes thereon takes effect the day after the election unless the measure provides otherwise” (Art. 18, sec. 4). This, too, was violated by a single judge’s poorly argued decision.()
  4. “Iftar (Arabic: إفطار‎), refers to the evening meal when Muslims break their fast during the Islamic month of Ramadan.”()
  5. Fred Jackson, “U.S. military destroys soldier’s Bibles,” OneNewsNow (May 5, 2009).()
  6. Paul Johnson, “‘Relentlessly and Thoroughly’: The Only Way to Respond,” National Review (October 15, 2001).()
  7. Quoted in Joseph Wheelan, Jefferson’s War: America’s First War on Terror, 1801–1805 (New York: Carroll & Graf Publishers, 2003), 40–41.()
  8. Robert Spencer, The Truth about Muhammad: Founder of the World’s Most Intolerant Religion (Washington, D.C.: Regnery, 2006) and Robert Spencer, The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades) (Washington, D.C.: Regnery, 2005).()
  9. Thomas Jefferson, congratulatory letter to Lt. Andrew Sterett (1760–1807). Quoted in Joseph Wheelan, Jefferson’s War: America’s First War on Terror, 1801–1805 (New York: Carroll & Graf Publishers, 2003), 102.()

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100 comments
OnkelSeosErbe
OnkelSeosErbe

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Bill
Bill

Arm yourselves ! Islamism is nothing, if it is not a cult set on conquering the world. Honor killings, stoning, beatings, etc. this is nothing but a cult wielding fear & submission. Pray, witness, proselytize but do not be meek.

Anonymous
Anonymous

This article and the comments truly scare me. I would rather not see any new mosques (or more accurately, religious centers) OR churches built but still defends the RIGHT for Americans to free exercise of religion, the rhetoric being spewed on this topic is truly frightening. What's worse is that most of you KNOW better, there is no secret Muslim conspiracy to takeover America, you just like entertaining the idea because it makes you feel more justified in your Us vs. Them mentality and Christian Persecution Complex. There are many problems facing the US today, many of them decades in the making, and politicians of every stripe have gone along with it. The people on top don't care about your religious ideology, except if they can USE it make you vote for the politician who will pass the laws they like or if they can get your money in any new way. STOP ALLOWING YOURSELF TO BE SHEPHERDED LIKE SHEEP and THINK! I grew up in a strong religious family, even worked for a religious organization in my early 20s. I now refuse to call myself a Christian, in large part due to the behavior and attitudes I encountered in Christians (and I don't just mean one bad person or one bad group). If you truly love Jesus, follow his teachings...judge not lest ye be judged...bless those that curse you and pray for those that despitefully use you. Reject those preachers and teachers that would try to rile you to "righteous" anger and stir you up into acting against your fellow man. They are just as bad as the Muslim fundamentalists who try to use religion to instigate violence. In Love, Anonymous

artbulla
artbulla

The article starts as the foundation argument, the example of a nation of murderers who rejoiced in the deaths of Joseph and Hyrum Smith, and who are the beast that "wore out the Saints of the Most High" (see Daniel 7), and you wonder why the judgments of an enraged Deity is upon you? Polygamy was practiced by Abraham AND Jesus. But I agree that Thomas Jefferson's war on the Moslems was justified, and the victory mosque should be opposed, because the religion itself urges war on the nation established by God, but which turned away from Him by murdering the prophets as Israel has always done, when God sent his servants to restore them from ignorance and error. The Law of Abraham has never and will never be removed, it would be easier to remove the sun from the sky. As John Taylor, 3rd President of the Mormon Church said: STATEMENT OF PRESIDENT JOHN TAYLOR As taken from the Salt Lake Tribune of date, January 6, 1880 "The people of the rest of the country are our enemies. They do not understand us, we do not understand them. We should pray for them but we MUST NOT YIELD to them. They think we are foolish and we think they are foolish; they think we are a pack of rascals, but we have the best of them, for we know they are a pack of rascals. We believe in honesty, morality and purity, in freedom and loyalty to our country: but when they enact TYRANNICAL LAWS, forbidding us the free exercise of our religion, we cannot submit. God is greater than the United States. And when the Government conflicts with Heaven, we will be ranged under the banner of HEAVEN and AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT. The United States says we cannot marry more than one wife. GOD SAYS DIFFERENT. We had no hand in the business, Joseph Smith had no hand in it; Brigham Young had no hand in it. I had no hand in it. It was all the work of God, and HIS LAWS MUST BE OBEYED. If the United States says different the Saints cannot obey it. We do not want to rebel against the United States. Rebellion is not on the program but we will worship God according to the dictates of our own conscience. We want to be friendly with the United States, if the Government will let us, BUT NOT ONE JOT NOR TITLE of our rights will we give up to purchase it. I would like the good God of heaven to prevent them from making laws that we CANNOT KEEP; but when adulterers and libertines pass a law forbidding polygamy the Saints CANNOT OBEY IT. Polygamy is a divine institution. It has been handed down direct from God. The United States CAN NOT ABOLISH IT. No nation on earth can prevent it, NOR ALL THE NATIONS OF THE EARTH COMBINED. I DEFY THE UNITED STATES. I will obey God. These are my sentiments, and all of you who sympathize with me in this position raise your right hands. All hands went up sustaining his position."

Brenda
Brenda

The Founders did not put up with tyranny, and we have at least as much cause, if not more, in our day. Most of them were Christians too. I'm not advocating violence, but soon more violence will be turned on us if this isn't stopped. World domination is the goal of Islam and it's followers. It's an unyielding hostile foreign government on our soil, and it will be convert or die!

@iProducer
@iProducer

This is by far one of the most powerful and compelling articles I have read on this issue. I am motivated now more than ever, to share this message everywhere and with every person that I can. Thank you Gary for taking time to research and compile this information for our benefit. America has changed, we are under attack by an aggressor who considers us their mortal enemy and will lie to get into our government for the purpose of changing our laws and we are at a crossroads... I am calling all Christians and Patriots to battle in the poling place. It is imperative that the President, every member of congress and every judge has been vetted out and is completely cleared of having any sympathy to the Islamic movement, period! My recent post 95 year Old Battleship sailor & Pearl Harbor Survivor tells obama to shape up or ship out!

Margaret
Margaret

Obama stated that Thomas Jeffeson hosted a Ramadan dinner in the White House. This is Taqiyya or lying to advance the cause of Islam. Thomas Jeffrson met the Dey of Algiers in London in 1786. According to the U.S. Veteran Dispatch of January 2007, written by Ted Sampley: When he became President in 1805 Jefferson sent the American navy to the Mediterranean and the U.S. Marines marched from Egypt to Tripolitania forcing the surrender of Tripoli and freeing Ameican sailors who had been enslaved by the Muslims.The Islamist agreed to abandon slavery and piracy which they had used to terrorize the sea and oceans of the world for more than a thousand years before Jefferson. ( shores of Tripoli in Marine hymn) The quotation cited by the Muslim Ambassador to Jefferson and Adams in London is included in the article by Ted Sampley This was not at a Ramadan dinner in Washington as President Obama stated. This is taqiyya or lying on behalf of a Muslim to advance Islam

Lee
Lee

Uh, maybe someone already posted this and I missed it, but the reason the First Amendment's provisions are enforced against states and localities is the Fourteen Amendment, which makes those protections binding on the states. You ruin an otherwise useful article by showing such ignorance. Did you even consider researching your question before posting this article? This is not a small thing. It's people like you that give basis to the claim by liberals that conservatives, especially religious conservatives, are uneducated and dumb.

Glen Haner
Glen Haner

Wow, this is a crafty and deceptive little article. I can't believe that a so called man of the faith would print the words: "So contrary to President Obama, it’s not true that all people have “the right to practice their religion." Are you seriously saying that US government was right in criminalizing the form of marriage practiced by the very father of the twelve tribes, and other OT prophets? They practiced polygamy, not child abuse. The same was true of the Latter-day Saints. Making polygamy a crime was itself a crime, an ex-post-facto law, forbidden by the Constitution. It was a case of one society that had prostitutes throughout her cities taking agressive action against the religion of another society where there were no prostitutes, because every woman could choose to be cared for by a legitimate husband. Murder is a genuine crime. It trumps any claim to religious freedom. Advocating murder and the overthrow of society is truly criminal. It should be outlawed. Religion that does not advocate crime SHOULD NEVER BE BANNED. Your claim to the contrary is disturbing.

Debbie
Debbie

To put the record straight first of all your statement that President Obama is a supporter of building the Mosque is totally inaccurate. He was stating a true fact when he said they had the right to build the Mosque according to t he US Constitution. Secondly the only mention of religion in the New York State Constitution is the following: ."No person shall, because of race, color, creed or religion, be subjected to any discrimination in his or her civil rights by any other person or by any firm, corporation, or institution, or by the state or any agency or subdivision of the state." So because of these facts it is totally Constitutional and legal to build a Mosque within 2 blocks of ground zero. I personally am not convinced that the Muslims were working alone when they took down the twin towers if indeed they had anything to do with it. Too many unanswered questions for me. And if you check out the FBI's website Osama Bin Laden is not even wanted for 9/11.

Sue Harper
Sue Harper

Americans must wake up and stop pandering to Muslims. I do not believe that this cult and I call it a cult because of the brutality towards women could ever want or be willing to assimilate into our country. This cult tears at the very fabric of our constitution and our Christian way of life. Mosques separate Muslims from our society both socially, academically and spiritually. It is a sorry state when one must question the issue of a Mosque at Ground Zero being appropriate. How disgraceful that Obama would even entertain the thought!!

Ross
Ross

I would ask that all come along to the Glenn Beck show at the Lincoln Memorial on 8/28. We Christians finally have a public voice where an individual of faith is able to express his faith. From the little town of Fredericksburg, VA there are six buses going. I will be on one of them. In my view there is a disconnect between Muslims and Islam. You can't have it both ways. Either you are a peace loving people or your not. I haven't seen many step out against the hatred and murder. So for bondservant. Whats your message to those who teach kill the Jews and Infidels?

Melissa Stewart Hancock
Melissa Stewart Hancock

It is amazing to me that after thousands of years of history showing us our enemy for who they are, that we are naive enough to believe that Islam is a peaceful religion. Seriously? That is why we are doomed to repeat it, willful ignorance.

Lucinda Schaefer
Lucinda Schaefer

The commandment does say to love thy neighbor, however, you must also be aware of thine enemies that wish to destroy you and your Christian friends. Even God's people knew who were their enemies and who wished to enslave them. Do you really think you are loved by your Muslim neighbor? Where's the money coming from for this new cultural center and mosque? No one will say. Are they afraid the answer will cause even more controversy? What New York City construction worker would even agree to work on this project? What about the church that was destroyed on September 11th? Why would a mosque be offered public land for their building when no other religion is allowed this consideration? Would you allow a Nazi cultural center next to Auschwitz? So many questions unanswered.

Gerardo009
Gerardo009

Mr. President and his consultants are wrong! I can´t believe that Mr. Obama supports a Mosque for pilgrims of the terrorism! In the Muslim World these terrorist are Heroes! Don´t forget that! - The American Society don´t want that Mr. Obama and nobody wants to hear your opinion! - You have not the sensibility of the American people! - Ground Zero is where Christians bodies were buried and souls went to heaven! - This certainly should not be a memory with a Muslim Mosque as a Tomb for these memories! Mr. Obama , if you don´t understand this message, please", go out from the USA! - Respect the American roots!

Dan
Dan

The federal Constitution is a minimum standard - states, local gov'ts, municipalities are bound by the US Constitution as well as the State Constitutions, all of which mimic the federal Constitution - there is a national prohibition on making laws respecting the establishment of religion - state and federal. BUT R.I.C.O. applies - follow the $$$ - terror funds from terror organizations - illegal money laundering.

M Potts
M Potts

It is wrong to state that no one was forced into a polygamist marriages. Many very young girls were forced by their parents and the men they married to enter into such marriage. Even in recent history, a rogue Mormon sect was found to have men married to very young girls in violation of the law.

Angel I. Camacho
Angel I. Camacho

I lived in a Muslim country 7 1/2 years. The average educated person was ok, however,the fanatics were horrible. They ate, slept and lived according to the principles dictated in their Koran, which I read while there. This religion not only controls their people, but the government too. They are the government. It is a horrible way of life. We as Americans have to wake up and do something about what is going on with this president and these people or someday we will find our nation lost to our old ways. Then it will take an all out civil war worse than the one to free the slaves, to get us from under these infidels, they would treat us even worse. We have to free our nation from this tyranny, this president must go. I can not understand how the American people would vote a Muslim person to be the leader of a Christian people. This is beyond comprehension. May God save us.

Arjun
Arjun

After 5 years of exhaustive research into the events of 9/11/2001, I have to completely agree with Ron a couple of comments above. Notice, that rather than debunk his claims, people (like "Una") attack him personally. WAKE UP PEOPLE! The fact is that the people are so scared to find out the truth that they will come up with every excuse to be apathetic, hurl personal insults, seek and find refuge in lies, etc. I have done extensive research into building construction, physics, jet fuel, etc. If I could debunk the claims that Ron has made, I would. But, the fact is that they are true. I have great confidence that all those who do diligent research into the subject will find it to be true, rather than hurl immature personal insults at those who have actually taken the time and energy to fervently seek out the truth. Grow up, take responsibility for yourselves, act like adults and stop living in a fantasy world. There is so much to learn and we need to know this information, as our criminal government sure will not divulge it to us.

Ron
Ron

I am truly sorry to see that so many Christians have fallen for this trick about the “Mosque near ground zero.” No one in these 44 comments has mentioned the plethora of evidence that shows the Muslims did not destroy the World Trade Center to start with. I am a Christian architect that attended the 4th Annual Super Conference just last July and I informed Dr. DeMar and 85 other attendees of the extensive evidence that proves that neither jet collisions nor the fire from jet fuel destroyed the twin towers and building 7 but nanothermite. Nanothermite is a new high-tech military laboratory made steel cutting explosive not found in the caves of Afghanistan but only in US and Israeli military labs only within the last 10 years. Tons of this material was placed throughout the buildings under the security of Larry Silverstein who bought the lease on the WTC six weeks before 9/11/01. And this was all done under the so-called watch of the “God fearing conservative Republican administration.” So if you think things are going to get better by electing Republicans I have bad news for you. So who cares if the Muslims build a Mosque next to ground zero? We don’t care enough about the deaths on 9/11/01 to even find out who really did it.

bonnie robson
bonnie robson

Why and who was Obama celebrating Ramandan with? All I can say is: Americans Vote in November, Vote in 2012 and send this non American back on his a double s to Chicago.

Tom
Tom

T"he same argument could be made over bigamy and polygamy since no one is forced into multiple marriages and thereby can’t suffer harm by the polygamous practices of others." what? There are plenty of young girls harmed both mentally and emotionally because they are forced into such relationships at very young ages. A 12 year old girl is NOT able to make a healthy decision to become a part of a multiple marriage arranged by her parents! Poor analogy!

Spanky
Spanky

Proverbs 17:5 The one who mocks the poor insults his Maker, and one who rejoices over disaster will not go unpunished.

Barbara E. Ward
Barbara E. Ward

Great article...a must read for everyone. How do our elected leaders continue to get away with everything they say and do that is hurting our country. We are fast losing our role as a leader of the world We used to be the lender and now we are the borrower, owing trillions to other countries. We elected these people and we have the right to fire them. When will somebody step up and do what is right, morally and scripturally. Our country was founded on Christian beliefs and there is no way to hide that or explain it away.

Gunner
Gunner

I just read an article where the Imam pushing the mosque says that he wants it to show that they(the Muslims building it) are not like those "other Muslims"...I assume he means the "extremists". If that is in fact true, why is it that when Americans started to object and have now turned it into a major battle, they didn't simply say, "In the interests of peace and pacifism and to show our solidarity with the victims of 9/11 and their families, we have decided to stop the process and find someplace else to build."???? They talk about not being like those "other Muslims" and yet when it is all boiled down...it's all rhetoric and crap and they just push to do what serves their own best interests...I personally don't care that they want to worship....just don't be so obnoxious about it and push for something that is that distasteful to so many.

una
una

This was an excellent article which dispelled many myths -- especially about Jefferson's alleged tolerance of Islam. However, after reading the comments at the end, I'm afraid to share the article with my friends because some comments justify our enemies' charge that Christians are uneducated, gun-toting loonies. I can appreciate the anger, but please, folks, let's not call for violence and let's watch the spelling and grammar. We don't need to give our enemies any more ammunition. Thanks.

una
una

This was an excellent article which dispelled many myths -- especially about Jefferson's alleged tolerance of Islam. However, after reading the comments at the end, I'm afraid to share the article with my friends because some comments justify our enemies' charge that Christians as uneducated, gun-toting loonies. I can appreciate the anger, but please, folks, let's not call for violence and let's watch the spelling and grammar. We don't need to give our enemies any more ammunition. Thanks.

Vinny
Vinny

Barbara, how true. but is it really are Country any more. we are letting it slip away. I been seeing that most People fall for any lie & bull story's that they hear. Not looking it up for themselfs. we are getting more & more lazy we talk the talk but we dont walk the walk.This is the time for Street Smarts Because all the book smarts where fooled.& what about all theses so call Christain that Voted for a baby killer that did not know hes butt from hes Elbow. & he out talk the thinkers.GOD BLESS AMERICA.

JD Blair
JD Blair

While it its true that we were taught as Christians to love our enemies and to turn the other cheek, did Christ himself not also warn us of false prophets and tell us not to follow them, as his way was the way and the light? As I see it (and I have studied the major religions of the world, including Islam) Mohammed was a warlike pedophile who was a false prophet and the entire purpose of Islam is to convert he world, violently, if need be, to Islam and to impose Sharia law on every country on earth. Do any of you here who warn us be tolerant of Muslims really believe Jesus Christ and God want us to submit to that? If so, ou are misled. There is one true God and he did not want us to bow to Mecca five times a day and then take up arms in the struggle (jihad) to convert the world to Islamic faith and sharia law. I propose God would want all true believers to wipe this scourge of the false prohet, Mohammed, from the face of the Earth. A great war is coming soon, as Islam is the fastest growing religion and has the fastest growing population group of any religion on Earth. No to the Mosque, they want it there as a sign of their conquest of us at the WTC, anyone beleiving otherwise has scales on their eyes and cannot see the truth. We should never let them build this mockery of their savagery towards the west so near such a sacred site, and further, forget tolerance of a relgion of war, we wil have to kill or be killed, where Islamic jihad is concerned. Finally, our President is an evil, secretive man, and one who we know so little about due to his hiding his records from kindergarten through Harvard law school, as his first official act, that it shows he is hiding much from us. do not trust this man, as no other President has ever done anything of the kind, does this not give any of you pause, when he dropped the national day of prayer yet he openly celebrates Ramadan in the white house? Impeach the imposter and get ready to fight islamci Jihad as the last great fight of the world, it is coming as surely as Iran is going to build nukes and sue them , unless stopped very soon. This is all tied together, open your eyes, America and see evil as it is, for what it is, right in front of you.

Dee VanNote
Dee VanNote

If he doesn't like the way we do things in this country, he needs to take his family and move to a muslim country. We do not want to fundamentally change our country. We need to keep praying for our country.

Angela
Angela

In San Antonio, Texas nobody is allowed to construct any building or structure near the sacred grounds of the Alamo that would even cast a shadow on the Alamo. (Remember the Alamo) Therefore, Muslims should not be allowed to build any mosque (which celebrates defeating an enemy) anywhere near Ground Zero in New York. It would be considered a huge slap in the face if this mosque is built anywhere near the former World Trade Center site in New York. Don't they have enough of their "hate America" houses in this country already? Will they allow us to build a Christian church in one of their countries? Not on your life! We can't even let Bibles be seen by Muslims there. It incites too much hatred. At least in the United States we don't have to hide our faces. We need to stand up to these radical people or suffer the consequences.

Mark Pitzke
Mark Pitzke

From what I have heard Tunisia, as a country, did not exist in Jefferson's day. The so called ambassador was meeting with Jefferson to try to extract a ransom for some American sailors that were captured by the Pirates from the Barbary coast area. This ambassador requested a room from Mr. Jefferson and also Concubines. Jefferson refused the ransom and he, followed by Madison took on the pirates until they were no longer a threat to American shipping. There is also NO referal to Mr. Jefferson hosting an iftar for this person that Barack Hussein Obama is calling an ambassador. He certainly did not come here in peace. The bombers who attacted us don't need a memorial to them built so close to ground zero either. How many recruits do you think that will generate?

bondservant
bondservant

Amazing how much hatred comes from so many who are apparently Christian (of which I am one). Whether the mosque is right or not (and I tend to believe it comes down to private property rights), scripture does say to love our enemies. Sad to say that many of the comments about this article do not reflect that command.

Rene
Rene

God might have been fine with polygamy in the old testament; but, God says that we are to obey His son Jesus. Have you read what Jesus says? Scripture clearly shows he was against polygamy and that is God's will.

Jaz
Jaz

"Polygamy was practiced by Abraham AND Jesus. " Says WHO??? You say it like it is fact and it is NOT.

Jaz
Jaz

No, he wasn't saying the gov't was right. He was saying the gov't DID ban polygamy so therefore obama is wrong in saying 'all' religions are equal here. They are not. He even went as far as to say 'no people are forced into multiple marriages.' Don't shoot the messenger!

Una
Una

Sorry, Ron, but you're an idiot.

Spanky
Spanky

If you have never read Ezekiel Chapter 1, the four faces described are the depiction of those who are called to serve the Lord: The face of a lion - A creature that does not flinch when confronted with any other, no matter its size. The face of an Ox - a creature that works tirelessly, never ceasing in strength. The face of an eagle - a creature with unsurpassed vision - a Godly vision for serving, yet as the eagle cares for its young, it must teach them to soar - it bumps them out of the nest and dives after them, catches them and returns them to the nest. This is repeated untill they know how to fly. The face of a man - We are created in the image of our Father in heaven, eternal beings who are meant to serve Him according to the gifts we are given. Excerpt from a sermon by Pastor Tim Hall - Turning Point at Calvary - August 11, 2010

Housam
Housam

That's a quick-witted answer to a difficult queiston

Edgar M. Gonzalez
Edgar M. Gonzalez

Hold it right there Bondservant. What is the Bible mean when it says "be gentle as a dove, but shrewed as a serpent"? It looks like you suffer from tunnel vision. I would excuse you making a mistake like this only if you were a Baby believer,

Jerritte Couture
Jerritte Couture

@bondservant and @Fortyver: It would serve both of you well to read this article -- http://bit.ly/aPerfectHatred. It is incredibly important to read exactly what God's Word says. Jesus tells us to "love YOUR enemies." (Matthew 5:44) However, this does NOT mean we are to love God's enemies. If you read on in Matthew 5, you'll see that Jesus finalizes this teaching with "Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect." (Matthew 5:48) So, answer this question: Can you find anywhere in the Bible where God Himself hates HIS enemies? I bet you can...many, many times. If God is perfect and He hates HIS enemies, and we are supposed to be perfect like He is, but we are to love OUR enemies, does that make this a contradiction? No. It simiply means that we are to love OUR enemies but hate GOD'S enemies. Jesus says "He who is not with Me is against Me; and he who does not gather with Me scatters." (Matthew 12:30) Clearly, Muslims are against Christ. These are not just OUR enemies, but the enemies of Christ Himself. How do we know that? Muslims are part of "those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh." (2 John 1:7) Be careful how you understand this. They see Jesus as a prophet, not as the Messiah. Saying that is denying who Christ is. What does this make them? Read on in the same verse: "This is the deceiver and the antichrist." It seems pretty clear that they're not just our enemies, but the enemies of God Himself. Yes, I do believe that it may be appropriate at times to pray for them, to ask the Lord to bring them into repentance, but even Jesus Christ limited some of His prayers to ONLY those whom the Father gave to Him. See John 17:9-10. Read the rest of His "High Priestly Prayer," as it is known, so you get the full context, which makes it abundantly clear that there are DEFINITELY differences in the way that Christ looks at those whom the Father gave Him (Christians) versus those He did not (non-Christians) (or the sheep versus the goats in John 10). Although I don't really agree with how @Sprayman0 began his response, I think his underlying message was that of Hebrews 5 and 6: "12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you have need again for someone to teach you the elementary principles of the oracles of God, and you have come to need milk and not solid food. 13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is not accustomed to the word of righteousness, for he is an infant. 14 But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil." (Hebrews 5:12-14) "1 Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do, if God permits." Another important thing to pull out of these passages is in 5:12 above (Hebrews). Mature Christians are to te "trained to discern good and evil." Are we to love evil? Are we to endorse and promote evil? This country is so deceived with secular teaching that we don't even understand our own Bible! Is Islam opposed to God's Word? Yes! Is homosexualtiy clearly condemned in God's Word (both in the OT and NT)? Yes! Should be then love them and ACCEPT their practices? NO! NO! NO! Should we share the Word with them and help those who are willing to submit to God's Word with their sins? YES! It baffles me that "Christians" don't understand such basic teachings. Loving others does not mean endorsing their evil behaviors and teachings. If your child runs out onto a busy street without looking, do you endorse that out of "love", or do you correct it QUICKLY and emphatically, without compromise out of love? Remember, "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 3:16-17). I do agree with @Sprayman0 that you need to be taught and corrected on your views on this topic. The article I linked to at the beginning of my comments will help you along that path. Hopefully the Holy Spirit has led me in writing this response so that the He can use it to convict you of some of your unscriptural beliefs in order to lead you to a better understanding of God's Word, so you will no longer need to be fed milk on this topic. For further reading, I HIGHLY suggest Gary DeMar's "Myths, Lies, and Half Truths" (http://bit.ly/mythsLiesHalfTruths). It will open your eyes to many topics along this same path. Your brother in Christ, Jerritte

Fortyver
Fortyver

@bondservant - You are so right. The comments will only serve to further alienate others, as they look upon what was once a loving and embracing faith, that has become a hateful and xenophobic shell of itself.

Sprayman0
Sprayman0

My poor little limp wristed christian brother. Yes the Bible does say love your brother. Have you ever stopped to think about the fact that God in heaven did not roll over and give Lucifer a go ahead to take over Heaven? The same rules apply when another intity tries to take over. Do you have your head buried so deep in the sand that you do not realize that Islam wants to control you. If you do not convert they will kill you or make you a third class person. Even Jesus got pissed and ran the money changers out of the synagogue with a whip. Wise up brother,being a Christian certainly does not mean you just give in to evil.

David Slesinger
David Slesinger

Una, are you a trained practicing architect like Ron? There are over 1250 architects ands engineers at AE911Truth.org who say the three towers fell from planned demolition. Here's a simple argument. Because all 3 towers fell symmetrically, that means every point equidistant from the ground lost ALL support INSTANTANEOUSLY. I'd like to the anyone feeling the love of Jesus Christ would be able to disagree without ad hominem attacks.

Edgar M. Gonzalez
Edgar M. Gonzalez

What a wallop Jerritte. Thank you, that was very well said, indeed. Blessing on you, brother.

Jeff
Jeff

@bondservant and @Fortyver: Finally, I thought I was going to have to weigh in to correct the weakness of bondservant's and Fortyver's attitudes, but I think you covered it pretty well. All I will add it that if I had been in a position to (i.e. the President) when 9/11 happened, Mecca would have become a parking lot and there would now be thousands of Christian churches all across the Middle East!!!!!!! The Muslim call to prayer is not one of the "prettiest sounds on earth" as our illegal President thinks, it is one of the most insidious and discusting sounds on earth. The sound of lies,deceipt and oppression, and YES, those who uphold it are enemies of the one true God and of Jesus Christ! No apologies offered. The best way we can love these people is by opposing their ungodly tyranny with every ounce of energy we have, with God's help and grace, and hopefully by converting many of them away from a system of lies to the truth, but most certainly NOT by sitting back and letting them jihad us all into "submission" and calling that "loving your enemies"!

Melissa Stewart Hancock
Melissa Stewart Hancock

@ bondservant too, love and accept the person, fight to the death the ideology of the Muslim who take advantage of weak minded and yes limp wristed Christian's good nature. How do you hold your shield if your wrist is limp? You don't. You drop it, and accept all arrows aimed at you. It comes down to lazy Christianity and spiritual warfare that is being lost on our end. To all you Christians who are fine with becoming followers of Allah and/ or beheaded, let those Muslim's lead you to believe they are a peaceful culture. To everyone else it's time to grow a pair and stop letting the enemy take ground that is ours! Get on your knees America! THE TIME FOR PROACTIVE PRAYER IS PAST! THIS IS THE LAST HOUR AND OUR OIL LAMPS ARE EMPTY!

Fortyver
Fortyver

What would you be alluding to with your "Poor Limp wristed Christian Brother" comment? To be a loving, accepting, rational human being does not imply a wimpish demeanor. But to respond to an honest assessment of how American Christianity has found itself responding to challenges to their beliefs with a brutish, oafish, insult to ones masculinity, only further affirms that we are losing our way.

busymom
busymom

Hmmm. So, it sounds like you are suggesting a HUGE conspiracy that includes the media. I lived in Australia at the time of the attacks and saw the second plane crash into the towers as the first tower's problems were being discussed. It seems that if the towers were built similarly that they would fall similarly. I am not an architect but I believe that the planned demolition happened just as we witnessed it - by a group of terrorists who flew airplanes into the buildings as they'd planned. The pentagon crash seems to also put a wrench in the conspiracy theory. I have not heard - do the architects also believe that to be a planned demolition as well? I just can't imagine that . My husband worked in the pentagon until four weeks before the attacks. I honestly just can't imagine that it is all a conspiracy. What about the plane that crashed over PA? Was that all part of the planned demolition too? I simply can't agree that all the evidence points to planned demolition. I CAN agree with you that we should be gracious and kind in our responses - whether we agree with each or not.