Comments on: A New Kind of Church

By: jake

jake — Sun, 25 Apr 2010 04:54:21 +0000

I have come to the conclusion that the church is the problem in many ways, yet agree wholeheartedly with Eric as well. As long as the church deals with the problem directly, I believe it is bound to fail. The church will develop new programs to teach its youth, removing the youth from their families for more time. As well parents will think that the youth are being trained at church so surrender their responsibility as well as time to church (or Christian schools).

I believe the church needs to encourage parent's, particularly the fathers, to take responsibility for the training of their children. If the church can come to grips with the concept that it is not its domain to train children, and that it does not have much direct control over the training of children, then it has gathered much wisdom. I believe the church has a crucial role to play, but an indirect role in training children. This role is to encourage parents to take their rightful role in the training of children.

Since most churches do not understand this concept, Eric is correct that parents must take this responsibility and not expect anyone else to train their children. Unfortunately, many will be looked down upon for taking their God given roles, making it less likely that they will. They will need to find encouragement from elsewhere, and fortunately this encouragement is available in the right locations, some alluded to by Eric, others from family friendly churches, or the concept of Uniting Church and Home, and others from the home schooling movement.

By: dlormand

dlormand — Sun, 18 Apr 2010 14:30:55 +0000

Sorry, Eric, this doesn't fly. I agree that the lack of godliness in Christian families is (a significant part of) the problem. But do you think that these godly parents just appear out of thin air? No. Such husbands and wives are _disciples_, and if we don't have them (and we don't), it is because the church is failing at its (uncontested, undeniable, God-given) role of disciple-making. And furthermore, the failure of the church to make disciples (rather than making _converts_, or much less to be anything other than satisfied with preaching ineffective sermons and singing emotion-pleasing songs) is not a result of the church "lamenting its ineffectiveness". No, Eric, the western church actually _is_ ineffective. That's _why_ we have guys like Brian McLaren running around.

By: storyteller

storyteller — Sun, 18 Apr 2010 00:38:23 +0000

I like what you have said here Lori, very much to the point. Additionally, I would agree with Mr. Rauch for the most part, but in the last paragraph he differentiates between the church and the family in terms of who is responsible for families. I on the other hand would have to say I see the responsibility as being one that must be addressed by both the church and families. After all, it is families who make up the church.

Yes, we as the body of Christ must respond to the needs of families, and familes who accept Christ as Lord then have the responsibility to become disciples under the guidance of the doctrine of their church. Many churches (Bodies of believers) today have abandoned the elemental and essential role of discipleship for those who are new to Christianity. As a small group mens discipleship leader in my church, I can tell you the most fulfilling experience is to watch men and families grow in their understanding of the basic theology of Christianity, and to apply the principles of Christian living to their lives.

Families thrive when their lives are centered upon God, and continue to grow and mature spiritually when they are engaged in learning the biblical principles for manhood, womanhood and the example of servant-leadership demonstrated to us through Christ. My church is among those that are living proof that the example given by the early church for making disciples out of people, leads to growth of the body, and solid funamental spiritual growth.

By: pericone

pericone — Sat, 17 Apr 2010 19:32:49 +0000

This is right on!, there's been an attack on the family for years and from many angles, just too innumerable to mention. From Dr. Spock to, portraying all sorts of fun without consequences on TV, in music, liberal policies. Couple that with the fact that babysitters are raising the kids. We have no time to raise citizens for heaven.

patricia

By: Sue

Sue — Sat, 17 Apr 2010 16:33:00 +0000

There are many out there these days who have had no contact with the church or Christianity. I agree that the home is where we learn the basics of self discipline and what it is to be a part of God's larger family. If that were being done, the church would be freed up to bring in the lost and demonstrate (as opposed to talk about) the truth of the Gospel.

By: Lori

Lori — Sat, 17 Apr 2010 14:49:53 +0000

I agree that the family plays an important role in society but when the Church has not taught objective moral truths people are easily lead into all sorts of false teachings. It is the Church that is to form conscience and our society is a reflection of the lack of courage by the moral leaders of our day to speak about what sin is and that we are called to judge right from wrong. "Thous shalt not judge" has been used to promote tolerance and a false love that has left us all moral relativists. We aren't called to jude who will be in heaven or hell because only God knows that but he wants us to not only judge right from wrong but out of love we are called to correct our brother who is doing wrong. When we present the truth we act in love, we act in the best interest of another. We don’t pretend that there is no truth, or that truth is what one feels or what one thinks at a given time or under a certain circumstance. It was Jesus who said that the truth will set you free! So when we speak the truth we are giving a sincere gift of love to others.